Is the ocean broken?

[ImaginaryNumber]

This is only true when that change in altitude brings the mass closer to the axis. This would occur at or near the Equator, but changing altitude near the poles doesn't move mass much towards our away from the axis. In fact, losing ice mass from the altitudes near the poles would have the effect of redistributing the mass towards the equator, which would effectively shift mass away from the axis of rotation and this slow down rotation. In other words, Global Warming should cause a slowing of rotation, not a speeding up.

-Will (Dragonfly)

Your argument regarding melting polar glaciers seems good to me. However, your discussion didn't include the melting of temperate and tropical glaciers, so I'm not sure whether it's true that "Global Warming should cause a slowing of rotation, not a speeding up"? Maybe the Earth will initially tend to speed up due to the melting of temperate and tropical glaciers, but then slow down as those glaciers disappear and the melting of polar glaciers picks up? I've got my millisecond stopwatch at the ready! <laugh>

 

[Will Gilmore]

However, your discussion didn't include the melting of temperate and tropical glaciers,

I've never heard anyone factor temperate and tropical glaciers into the equation for ocean rise. I assume they don't represent a significant addition to the Earth's diameter due to their relatively small mass. However, I don't have a clue about them. They are not in the AGW news very much.

-Will (Dragonfly)

 

[ImaginaryNumber]

I've never heard anyone factor temperate and tropical glaciers into the equation for ocean rise. I assume they don't represent a significant addition to the Earth's diameter due to their relatively small mass. However, I don't have a clue about them. They are not in the AGW news very much.

-Will (Dragonfly)

Contribution of the Cryosphere to Changes in Sea Level

The most significant contributors to sea level within the current climate are glaciers, but ice sheets in Greenland and Antarctica hold the potential to eventually dwarf other cryospheric contributors to sea level rise.

Current conditions: contribution from melting glaciers
Global sea level is currently rising as a result of both ocean thermal expansion and glacier melt, with each accounting for about half of the observed sea level rise, and each caused by recent increases in global mean temperature. For the period 1961-2003, the observed sea level rise due to thermal expansion was 0.42 millimeters per year and 0.69 millimeters per year due to total glacier melt (small glaciers, ice caps, ice sheets) (IPCC 2007). Between 1993 and 2003, the contribution to sea level rise increased for both sources to 1.60 millimeters per year and 1.19 millimeters per year respectively (IPCC 2007).​

Mountain Glaciers Are Major Contributors to Rising Seas

They are as big a source of sea level rise as the Greenland Ice Sheet and larger than Antarctica​

Fast-Melting Mountain Glaciers Speed Up Sea Level Rise

Satellites spy on remote alpine glaciers, producing more accurate—and higher—estimates of ice loss over time.​

Around the World, Small Mountain Glaciers Add to Sea Level Rise

3) The melting of small mountain glaciers and icecaps from all continents is expected to contribute about 12 cm to global sea level rise by 2100, according to a new study.​

 

[hoytedow]

No one addresses the elephant in the room.
Warm air holds a tremendous amount of water and pulls water from the oceans through evaporation.

 

[ImaginaryNumber]

Climate crisis will cause falling humidity in global cities

• Cities only account for about 3% of global land surface, and few models produce data specific for urban areas
  
• Urban regions around the world are likely to see a near-universal decrease in humidity as the climate changes
  
• Asphalt and concrete surfaces absorb more solar radiation creating an “urban heat island effect”
• Temperatures in cities can be up to 5C (9F) warmer than surrounding rural areas
  
• Planting trees would help reduce temperature by releasing water into the atmosphere, which cools down the air

The paper was published in Nature Climate Change

 

[hoytedow]

What's your plan? Depopulation?

 

[Will Gilmore]

Move the thermometers out of the cities.

-Will (Dragonfly)

 

[hoytedow]

It will be like Pol Pot's Cambodia. They will move us out of the cities and forbid agricultural efforts > starvation.

 

[ImaginaryNumber]

Why Seagrass Could Be the Ocean's Secret Weapon Against Climate Change

• Seagrasses are terrestrial immigrants. Like land grasses, they grow leaves, roots, rhizomes, veins and flowers
• Scientists estimate the Posidonia oceanica meadows in the Mediterranean Sea are at least tens of thousands of years old, and possibly as many as 200,000 years
• They’re like the Serengeti grasslands of Africa—host to a wide array of animals
• Seagrasses provide habitat for fish, sea horses and crustaceans; food for sea turtles, waterfowl and marine mammals; and nurseries for an astounding 20 percent of the largest fisheries on the planet
• A U.N. report estimates that seagrasses perform up to 18 percent of the ocean’s carbon sequestration, even though they cover only about 0.1 percent of the ocean floor
• A seagrass meadow can be just as effective as a temperate forest in sequestering carbon, sinking it into the sediment for decades or even centuries.
• Approximately 7 percent of global seagrass coverage disappears each year, similar to the loss of coral reefs and tropical rainforests.
• Sites in Florida as well as Europe and Australia have succeeded in reviving seagrass populations, both with active reseeding and with passive restoration efforts such as reducing fertilizer and soil runoff

 

[ImaginaryNumber]

Climate change and 'atmospheric thirst' to increase fire danger and drought in NV and CA

• Climate change and a "thirsty atmosphere" will bring more extreme wildfire danger and multi-year droughts to Nevada and California by the end of this century
• These changes were largely driven by warmer temperatures, and will likely lead to significant on-the-ground environmental impacts
• Higher evaporative demand during summer and autumn means faster drying of soil moisture and vegetation, and available fuels becoming more flammable
  
• Even in locations where precipitation may not change that much in future, droughts are going to become more severe due to higher evaporative demand

Materials provided by Desert Research Institute

 

[hoytedow]

Our seagrass bed is doing great!
Proper forestry techniques which are forbidden by the wacko left would greatly improve conditions of Ca. and Nev. woodlands.

 

[Will Gilmore]

• Higher evaporative demand during summer and autumn means faster drying of soil moisture and vegetation, and available fuels becoming more flammable

• Even in locations where precipitation may not change that much in future, droughts are going to become more severe due to higher evaporative demand

I don't think the logic works behind this statement. Evaporation is based on relative humidity, and, while warmer air holds more moisture, there is nothing to prevent that moisture from saturating the air at those higher temperatures. Once the saturation level has been reached, any cooling will cause condensation and rain until the condensation nuclei have been cleared out or the air warms back up. Condensation and rain, causes cooling and cooling leads to more condensation and condensation is required for rain. It is a cycle that will feed itself until there are no more stored resources to keep it going, then it starts all over again. Climate temperature is relative, in this case. Moisture will saturate the air because there is enough water to do that. It doesn't matter whether it is ice or liquid, evaporation can happen at any temperature. Higher ocean's equal more surface area with better wind driven evaporation.

-Will (Dragonfly)

 

[hoytedow]

Evaporation even occurs in freezing temperatures through a process called sublimation.

 

[benjamin m peterson]

ImaginaryNumber,
Im new here and didnt see a way to message you directly. If you could message me I have a question about another thread you posted before. If this goes against the rules of the forum i apologize. thanks.

 

[ImaginaryNumber]

Benjamin, welcome to Boat Design.

I don't think you can use the PM system until you've made a certain number of posts (perhaps 5?). Or, if you wish to post your email address, I will contact you directly.